I visited my local auto machine shop (West Bay in Bremerton, Washington) and talked to Martin the machine shop manager. He offered to find a pair of heads with my casting number, 14102193 deck them to raise the compression to 10-1 and, for common sense reasons, perform a valve job before handing them to me for gooving. He would then take my stock heads as cores.
This way I can get the job done over a weekend and not be without the truck and not have to purchase a set of heads for the project.
I've also fitted the Helix tower under the throttle body but cannot yet tell if that alone has improved the fuel milage as it is claimed it will do.
TH
Hi all,
I've just purchased a 1988 GMC Jimmy with a Chevy 350 V8 motor. I need such a large vehicle as my hobbies require the towing of large trailers.
Therefore I need to get the very best mile-per-gallon figure I can.
Currently with a stock engine, K&N air filter and 3" bore exhaust i'm getting 15 mpg per US gallon (not towing).
I'm currently sourcing a rebuilt set of heads specifically to deck and groove them per the thinking and specifications of Mr Singh.
I also intend to install a shift kit in the transmission to hold the vehicle in 4th gear (again not towing)
Other ideas are water injection and a Helix throttle body spacer (which I have but have not yet fitted).
I'll keep you posted on the progress.
If anyone else is working on a similar path with a Chevy 350 I'd be pleased to hear fronm you.
Regards,
Trevor Heath Port Orchard, Washington USA
Post edited by: trevor, at: 2005/11/24 17:12
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/01/22 01:16
By: somender
Status:
Karma: 4
Trevor!
Looking forward to progress. Please do a small amount of baseline data gathering.
Even something as mundane as average times you fill the tank vs miles driven. Driving characteristics etc.
Does it knock on low-octane fuel? How quick to respond to the throttle?
When the heads come off, photograph the entire setup. Note burned areas and color/amount of debris and not how long the heads were used since last port n' polish.
Note similar or same info afterwards especially the 'regular driving' mpg, towing characteristics and sensation when the pedal hits metal and rubber meets the road.
This is a simple and practical operation!
Have your mechanic get in touch with any questions. Your project has already been done here with success. See the GMC truck in Test Results Section.
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/01/23 17:11
By: automotive breath
Status:
Karma: 3
trevor wrote: ... Therefore I need to get the very best mile-per-gallon figure I can. Currently with a stock engine, K&N air filter and 3" bore exhaust i'm getting 15 mpg per US gallon ...
Read about fuel consumption testing my grooved Suburban.
Good luck with the Truck and a little common sense engineering!
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/02/06 22:00
By: trevor
Status:
Karma: 1
Updated 2/6/2006
Progress is being made. I could not find a spare set of heads for a resonable price but my daughter, now 16 needed a car so instead of buying a spare set of heads for the 350 I bought a 1984 Volvo Station Wagon for the same money.....700 bucks!
This means I can take my time with the 350 and that's what I'm doing.
The heads were pulled this weekend and delivered to the West Bay machine shop tonight. In the Volvo of couse!
Pulling the heads was not an enjoyable task at all. The vehicle is 18 years old and clearly it had never been disasembled before. Everything seemed tight and every exhaust manifold bolt was rusted solid. I'm fortunate to have only broken one which the machine shop stated thay can drill out without any difficulty.
Disasembly, cleaning and magnaflux will come first.
It is also the first time i've ever taken an engine apart that had nothing wrong with it (except poor fuel consumption!!!!)
For the record the vehicle was getting 14.8 MPG (US GALLON) in stock trim except for a K&N air filter and a 3" exhaust from the cat to the tail pipe.
The helix base did not seem to do anything, not sure if I will refit it or not...suggestions anyone?
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/02/12 14:29
By: trevor
Status:
Karma: 1
Updated 2/12/06
Received the head back from the machine shop ready for grooving on Friday. I've cut the grooves and will now return the head to the machine shop tomorrow Monday 2/13/06 for final assembly.
While cleaning the exhaust manifolds I found one badly cracked (under the heat riser sheet metal) so that manifold will have to be replaced.
A very strange experience cutting the grooves. Not the actual cutting which is very straight forward but the mental side of things.
That all the billions spent on R&D all over the world by massive companies did not figure this out. That it took a humble man from India to set us all straight.
I guess I'll have to put it down to arrogance and NIH (not invented here) on the part of the automotive companies.
TH
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/02/13 12:28
By: automotive breath
Status:
Karma: 3
trevor wrote: Updated 2/12/06
Received the head back from the machine shop ready for grooving on Friday. I've cut the grooves and will now return the head to the machine shop tomorrow Monday 2/13/06 for final assembly.
That all the billions spent on R&D all over the world by massive companies did not figure this out. That it took a humble man from India to set us all straight.
TH
Great work Trevor, did you get any pictures? Please provide specs that will determine critical clearances and compression ratio.
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/03/05 21:53
By: trevor
Status:
Karma: 1
Engine is back together. Just need to hook up the exhausts, refit the power steering and A/C compressor and I'm done.
I've forgotten how the brackets go for the A/C compressor and was getting tired so it will have to wait until next weekend.
All in all a very difficult job on this particular vehicle because it is a 4 x 4 (1988 GMC JImmy full size) the whole job has to be done standing on a step ladder.
The saying "no pain no gain" really applies. I sure hope I've got it right.
I've not taken any photo's there are many already taken of this style head. I had the heads machined .040" and cut one groove in each combustion chamber. Had a valve job done with new springs, seals and keepers. Because as previously stated this engine had never been apart before (179,000 miles) It was running fine before I took it apart.
Meanwihle a small side story.....
We have warm spell in mid February. The grass started growing. I pulled out the lawn mower and poured in fresh gas (drained it last fall per good practice).
Dispite priming the carb the damm thing would not start. Plenty of gas and spark.
The engine is a laid down Briggs side valve.
I could see all the head bolts so I pulled the head and cut one groove in it.
I re-installed the head, three pumps on the carb primer and pulled.....it started first pull
Yeeehaaaa!
TH
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/03/10 20:32
By: herning
Status:
Karma: 0
Hey Guys,
Trevor, I'm really interested in your results. I've got a 1995 K1500 extended cab I have had for 2 years now. I have kept track of the milage since day 1. I average about 15mpg, with my best ever at 17.5 mpg. Currently has 163,000 miles on it. Still runs strong and I really like the vehcile, except for the milage. So I am seriously thinking of getting a set of heads and getting them decked and grooved, then spend a saturday changing the heads. Just out of curiosity, how much work was it to adjust the valves? I know on the older 350's you had to adjust all the rocker arms after assy, but I believe this has hydraulic lifters in it, so maybe its not as hard as I think. The last vehcile I had heads off was a Toyota pickup with over head cams... so the shop I had do the head work set the valve lash for me. Keep us posted, I think I will call around to a few salvage yards in the morning and see if I can find a set of used heads.
Garrett
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/03/13 15:57
By: trevor
Status:
Karma: 1
Garrett,
I finished up the project on Saturday.
The motor started first try and while the ignition timing may still be a little off, the motor is idling smoother and, at a higher RPM than before the grooving.
In my case the motor had 176,000 miles on it and had never been apart before.
We replaced the valve springs and valve seals in addition to a "valve job" in addition to milling the head .040" and cutting the grooves.
While I still have the use of another vehcle, I decided to service the transmission and add a transmission cooler as well so it will be another week before I start putting miles on the Jimmy.
I agree with you though that I too find this vehcle very useful except for the fuel mileage, my best was 14.8 mpg per USG. previously.
I'm hoping to get 20 mpg per USG.
TH
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/03/13 22:18
By: herning
Status:
Karma: 0
Hi Trevor,
Great to hear your progress... Posted whats going on here in another forum and have someone with a '93 Suburban who is very interested in doing this as well.
I'm going to call an engine shop hopefully tomorrow thats done work for me in the past and see what they'd charge for the mill and a valve job and if they have any heads laying around... How hard was it to adjust the rocker arms? Looked mine 95 over this weekend as I was changing the oil... doesnt look too bad, figure I could get a set of heads swapped over a long Saturday if I had them all ready to go...
What are you planning on doing to the trans? Where I work we are one of only 2 companies that build test equipment for places than remanufacture transmissions, valve bodies and solenoids so I spend all day working with this stuff. Feel free to hit me up with any questions.
Garrett
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/03/30 12:27
By: pagesk
Status:
Karma: 0
Hi Trevor
Any results yet? I have been following your thread and several others with great interest. I happen to live just around the corner form you in Olalla.
Simon
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/03/31 02:32
By: somender
Status:
Karma: 4
Fellows... Once completed, please send photos and pertinent information, or post in this forum and we can place the info on our 'test results' section for posterity.
Thanks!
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/04/10 23:45
By: trevor
Status:
Karma: 1
Hi all,
Been travelling and then finally got a couple of oil leaks sorted out.
I have started to use the vehicle.
First test has shown a 14% increase in MPG from 14.8 to 16.9 (per USG)
This was achieved on a 153 mile circuit that was mostly freeway at 55-to 70 mph but did include 10+ miles of stop and go.
I've noticed that the engine is running a lot cooler, approx 160 degrees F
I'lll find out if there is a different thermostat I can try to raise the temperature back to 180-190 F
I also think it could stand a little more ignition advance.
But i'm pretty happy with a 14% increase.
Attached is an image of the rebuilt engine back in the truck
Trevor
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/04/21 22:26
By: herning
Status:
Karma: 0
Hey Guys,
Been making progress here. Found a set of similar heads and they are over at the engine shop. Heard today they cleaned up ok, magnafluxed out fine and the valves and springs were ok. He's going to do the valve job and then I'll get them back to groove before we do the decking. Ran some numbers and looked at some parts, if I go with some 0.015" head gaskets and a 0.050 deck, I can get 10.25:1 out of it... may see about a 0.060 deck if possible as that would put me at 10.4:1. Trying to line up a chassis dyno I can do a before and after run on. Will post my results as I get them.
Garrett
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/04/29 21:39
By: automotive breath
Status:
Karma: 3
herning wrote: Hey Guys,
Been making progress here. Found a set of similar heads and they are over at the engine shop. Heard today they cleaned up ok, magnafluxed out fine and the valves and springs were ok. He's going to do the valve job and then I'll get them back to groove before we do the decking. Ran some numbers and looked at some parts, if I go with some 0.015" head gaskets and a 0.050 deck, I can get 10.25:1 out of it... may see about a 0.060 deck if possible as that would put me at 10.4:1. Trying to line up a chassis dyno I can do a before and after run on. Will post my results as I get them.
Garrett
The picture of your head that you posted looks great. Let us know how it works out.
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Re:Chevy 350 grooving
Date: 2006/05/05 00:57
By: somender
Status:
Karma: 4
The grooves look a bit close to the edge?
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/05/08 00:44
By: pagesk
Status:
Karma: 0
those grooves look pretty close to the sealing surface for the head gasket. I would be worried about burning through the gasket
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/05/15 11:46
By: herning
Status:
Karma: 0
I took the grooves out to the inner edge of the head gasket... but will be putting them on next weekend.. we will see how they work out.... There is the possibility I may have gone a bit farther than I should have.
Garrett
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/05/15 15:11
By: mpgmike
Status:
Karma: 4
If you did, you'll know by the blown head gasket. If you don't break anything, then you did OK. At any rate, at least you're trying stuff and not sitting in front of the TV watching others do stuff. Let us know.
Mike
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Re:Chevy 350 groving
Date: 2006/05/15 19:25
By: herning
Status:
Karma: 0
That is true Mike... and if you never mess up... well then ya never learn anything! Worst case I can put the original heads back on and get another set to groove...
Garrett
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